| Archive for workinghprs.myfastforum.org Chat forum for owners of working HPR and Versatile gundog breeds. |
| karen |
Gundog Club Training Course and Grade One TestHas anyone been on one of these courses and are they good? |
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| windem bang |
The answer to that would be very dependant on how good the trainer is and how experienced with H.P.R.'s. Not all very good retriever and spaniel trainers make good H.P.R. trainers - somehow the mental attitude is wrong .
Find out what experience of H.P.R.'s the trainer has . Obviously it would be nice if he/she was experienced with your breed but that is really too much to ask for. I.M.O. if the trainer keeps on about walking to heel and doing long stay exercises, then he /she is incorrect for you . A loose form of heelwork is fine for our breeds , they are not labradors. Also needed for our breeds is a lot of ground to train hunting over. Does the trainer have that ? Game on the ground should not be expected, the birds have to breed but the ground itself should be good running ground or you will be wasting your money and your time . I looked into the Clubs tests myself but found them a bit too pricey for me. Other handlers seem to value the "certificate" handed out for passing a grade much more highly than I do . I read that a few people are not happy with the Gundog Clubs speed at setting up the more advanced tests ? I believe the club is doing its best to sort this out - make enquiries if you think your dog may be above absolute basics level . I found the folk running this club to be helpful but I wasn't being tested ! 
As with so many other things it boils down to - is it worthwhile to you ? Bill T. |
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| karen |
Thank you Bill. Apparently the course is being run by an Allan Hender who has GWPs and is an experienced field trials person and Judge. I don't know him but have heard good things about him.
Yes it is very pricey which is what is putting me off and why I'm enquiring about it. I am an absolute beginner so any training I'd find helpful. |
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| BritAnnie |
I think the complete course plus test used to be £120 and is now about £140. Allan Hender has run in some of our FTs so he has HPR experience. Another trainer however told me that she wasn't that keen on the HPR training and tests they provide, and that they only have two HPR levels at the moment. Basic obedience and one level up from that. Allez was registered with them, but I was put off by this lady. However, if you have nothing else available then they would be worthwhile. I understand they tend to be quite strong on the obedience side of things - walking to heel, sit stays etc. | ||
| Greymaster |
How old is your dog? You will probably find a lot of other gundog breeds in the Grade One course, and their G1 tests are slightly different, but that can be catered for each time your turn comes up within the group. If you have a very young dog then he will benefit from the socialisation that the group session will bring. G1 will focus on heel work, sit-stay and recall, with some whistlework, mainly recall. But £140 is expensive for socialisation when your local obedience class will achieve the same for a couple of quid a go. If you have everything but the whistlework, then the G1 course will prove expensive. The only other course is for G2, and if you have an older dog with all the basic obedience covered, you might want to try for this. TGC grading system has IMHO a great deal of merit in theory and I would endorse it wholeheartedly from an HPR perspective if they could demonstrate any sense of commitment to it themselves. The tests give you something to aim at. They have a great panel of HPR experts on call, but it is coming up to 12 months since their G2 HPR was published, with no sign of G3. Don't assume that you should be aiming at one grade test per annum, If you are really serious about making progress and have the time, you could possibly progress to G5 within 20 months, but the only thing holding you back will be the lack of available tests. However, if you get along to training opportunities provided by breed clubs, or the HPR Breeds Assocociation, or fellow HPR clubs you will pick up an awful lot of knowledge and experience from quite often the same people doing the courses, and it won't cost you an arm or a leg! |
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| karen |
Maggie is two years old. She has passed her silver KC award in obedience and I have trained her to come and stop to the whistle. She has a farily good recall , will heal off lead although not close like some Collies I have seen and is good at retrieving although not always putting the dummy calmly in my hands. I'm looking for someone to teach me to polish the edges of her training and also to take me a bit further with retrieving, hunting and pointing. I don't know how to teach her to point, or to hunt in a certain area or to stop her chasing. She will be called away from pheasants but will still try to chase. I feel she is a very clever girl and has a strong urge to hunt and I want to harness this in someway.
Thank you for you suggestions. |
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| windem bang |
Just about the last thing you need is for a gundog to heel like an obedience ring border collie ! I think you are probably doing well enough already with obedience work but that the work you have done needs "proofed" when and where game is around . I doubt very much if The gundog clubs trainer or training ground will provide that.
As has already been suggested I too think that you might be better served by attending H.p.r. only classes - you must have them down your way ? Only game can "teach" a dog to point - no trainer can do that. Dogs teach themselves to point when the birds that they fail to point get up and fly away. As I already mentioned you will need decent ground to run your dog on - teaching it on a nice short grassed field will very likely give you a " clockwork mouse" type hunter rather than the swashbuckling style that your breed is capable of. I.M.O. you need hunting practice and practice on how to behave in the presence of game you don't sound like you need much more in the way of obedience training. If the gundog club can provide what your dog needs then pay up and grin. If you think it cannot then go for some specialised classes, a few 1-2-1 sessions and then finally ,when you and your dog have some game experience, arrange with others to have a "shotover day " with your dog. Taken altogether I think that lot might cost £200 - £250 but it would have taken you far further on in your training and in experience for your dog. Just my opinion . Bill T. |
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| Lisa |
I agree Bill, it maybe for some people but I was a complete beginner this time last year and I considered the Gundog Club but decided to attend a few club training sessions instead and I feel Blu has come on great! Especially his hunting.
It's just me that needs more training and confidence but that will come in time I hope!!  I still like to consider myself a beginner though!  
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| cressy |
Karen - where abouts in Oxon are you?
I am no expert and at the mo my Brittany is not the worlds best pointer as he only meets wiley birds who know more than he does!!! But I am in Worcs and would be happy to meet to share my experiences if you like. |
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| karen |
Thank you Bill for taking the time to give me your opinion and advice. I guess you are probably right and have decided agains the Gundog Club course at least for now. I have a 10 week old puppy at home too so will be starting again soon. I have in fact registered her in a puppy class run by Mossenwood - Paul Tommey. He runs one to one gundog classes but also group classes now and again which is what I really want, so I may enquire further about this when I'm there with my pup. If not what I'm looking for I will carry on my search.
I really do appreciate everyone's come back on this so A Big Thank You! As I know everyone likes puppy pictures - Here is a picture of Elsa my new pup with her now best friend Maggie
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| karen |
Sorry Sue, missed your post. I'm in a small village about 10 miles from the centre of Oxford on the London side - so between Thame and Oxford. That does sound like fun though. | ||
| cressy |
When pup is old enough do you fancy meeting in Bernwood Forest? We can have a natter and let the dogs run amok , pup can do a little walk then perhaps chill for a time in the car?
Also there is a large area of open land near Cothill I have run the dogs on - no game, a few bunnies and the chance of meeting other dogs but ok for basics. |
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| greylag |
if you look on the hprinfo website there are details of training classes being held by the hprba just outside coventry. 10 week course starting towards the end of the month. | ||
| BritAnnie |
Aw aren't they so cute. That would be my next choice of HPR if I didn't have those dreaded Brits
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| greylag |
sorry karen my last post was a complete lie as iv just checked on hprft info site and cant find it.training is def happening tho as im alredy signed up.if your intrested you cauld email the secretary,sarah stephenson. fryerfold@googlemail.com | ||
| lagopuslagopus |
Is this what you're looking for?
Click to download file I've just noticed the date has passed but it's worth a phone call. |
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| karen |
Thank you 'Greylag' (sorry don't know your name) and Karen. I'll look into it.
Karen, are you the lady that makes those lovely lanyards? I lost mine the other day chasing Maggie, chasing a rabbit and as it's black took me ages to find it. Need a nice bright one. Sue - that sounds like a nice idea. |
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| lagopuslagopus |
Yes Karen - that's me.
Also, what about Madge Simons and Swifthouse Training - they are in Oxford. |
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| Bareve |
Not sure if Madge would do it but I know that Jennifer Hurley has helped quite a few HPR people
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| lagopuslagopus |
Worcestershire Gundog Society - www.worcsgundogsociety.co.uk
As far as I know the above do weekly training classes for HPRs too |
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| Lisa |
There is a thread with training clubs and details on here I have tried to add as many as I can but they do include the ones you have mentioned
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