| Archive for workinghprs.myfastforum.org Chat forum for owners of working HPR and Versatile gundog breeds. |
| josie |
showing europeHiGuy (and anyone else!) - tell me more about showing in Europe. How do you enter, where do you find out about shows, what are the classes? What is the format of what you have to do in the ring, and how does that differ to the UK? Guy, you piqued my curiousity by saying you were going to France for the Nationals - which I'm assuming is a show!? |
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| guy |
josie,
http://www.epagneul-breton.ws/en/shows/ne/nationale.php is the link to the Frenh National i have in mind. - but only of interest if you have a brittany. 
we went to watch the TAN last year everyone was very friendly and helpful - such that wee talked our way int a go on the deep water retrieve. Bear in mind silent whistles are illegal in French tests. We did not stay for the show the next day; but several English people there who would have made you most welcome. This year i am aware of quite a few who are intending attending (can i say that?) Put a post on the Brittany forum - there should be a few on there who have shown in Europe - or at least know about it. If not i can pm you a few contacts who would be more than pleased to help you. |
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| josie |
Oh, so are the Nationals a sort of working assessment, combined with a conformation assessment, and only for Brittanies? (Hope I'm understanding this right??) | ||||
| cressy |
Hi Jo - yep I think you have that right.
In the UK the Brittany Club run a weekend that includes a TAN and various other activites on the Sat and then a Champ Show the following day. Mugi and I and ?????? are hoping to attend in full. I am hoping the Britt Club will allow an 11 yr old to run a TAN if he is fit enough and then I am planning to enter him in the Champ Show Veteran class, again if he is still as fit as he is now. I do know that fossedata have schedules for some French and Belgium shows but I have no idea what the format is and if course the dogs will be judged to FCI standard. |
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| BritAnnie |
http://www.epagneul-breton.ws/fr/expos/ne/nationale.php
This is the annual French Brittany club event. This year is their centenary, and will be an extra special event - includes a 'foreigners day', visit to breeders kennels in Brittany, as well as loads of long dinners with hundreds of different courses and lots of wine - wonderful stuff . I am very excited already  and I am going on a family holiday to Florida before that.
Annie |
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| guy |
TAN for a veteran - hmm?
I am sure you will be able to run (personal opinion of course) but the TAN is a test for dogs under 3 years old. Josie - you will have to get yourself a Brittany (but beware one is never enough)
there must be other breed natonal shows, and there will be a FCI national show as well. |
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| cressy |
Well Guy, I have only had him 6 months and the lad has shown he knows what he should have been doing all his life (and he has me for a handicap too). As long as he is still fit I would love to try him through his TAN as he loves working in any form.
I so wish I had had him from a pup, he really should have done more although his previous family have obviously ensured he has kept his zest for life even in his older years. I love him to bits, he has done so much in his 6 months and he is developing a fan club .
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| BritAnnie |
I don't think we make that distinction in the Brittany Club, Guy. That is what they do in France. The only ones we don't allow to do the TAN proper are puppies under 6 months. Annie This is copied from Le Weekend brochure This is NOT a competition. All dogs taking part will be assessed and will receive a commemorative certificate, and those gaining a pass, in the assessors opinion, will receive a diploma of merit. The Stan Smith Memorial Trophy for Best TAN on the day will be presented by the two judges. In general, the dog is assessed on its natural ability in Hunting and Pointing, and also on its response to its handler’s commands. This is a very relaxed and informal assessment of the dog’s ability and is another way to enjoy our chosen breed. It is not a formal test of a trained gundog, merely an assessment of what our Brittanys’ instincts should be! |
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| guy |
I had understood the TAN was limited to under threes over here. But having said that would like to see the opportunity open to all.
Perhaps the wording could be 'The TAN is a test of 'Natural Ability' and in the spirit of such a test placing will be restricted to dogs with less two years experience in the field.' As an aside - if you take a TAN in england you can still take it again in France and again in Germany; in fact anywhere - but only once under each lead body. |
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| karenb |
Hi Josie
good post .. you must have been reading my mind! I have friends in Sweden who would like me to go out to the world show next year - www.worlddogshow2008.se - and I have been giving it serious consideration. I don't even have a passport myself so the prospect of traveling is more of a worry than the showing 
Have been doing some searching and I think you can book your dog onto the same flight as yourself but the dog would have to travel in the hold - does anyone have any experience of this or can recommend a shipping agent who would sort out the logistics for me ?? As for showing under FCI rules - it is somewhat different to the Uk. As I understand (and I may be confused  ) each country has its own rules regarding the number of CAC's required to claim it's National Champion title (CAC). However most gundogs also need a FCI working certificate (CAIT) to before you can claim the title Champion, or an approved Working Class certificate if not from a FCI counrty - not sure what they recognise as a Work Certificate from Uk competitions. Does anyone know ?
Some shows also have International Status (as does the world show) therefore CACIB's are also awards (international CC's) IF you have a National Title I think you need to win CACIB's in at least two countries to be awarded the International Champion title, and again I believe you also need a work certificate. Every dog is judged and given a quality grade and every dogs gets a written critique = More info on classes , gradings etc here - http://www.skk.se/ & http://www.fci.be/uploaded_files/...0Regulations_World_Section_EN.doc Also many European counrties have bans on showing docked dogs - I know it is ok to show in Belgium & Sweden but I think France & Holland have a ban and I am not clear about Germany as I think they can show docked "working" dogs but I am unsure as to what evidence is required??? Dates for all Eropean shows are available from the FCI web site and are listed in the Dog World Diary. Any extra info would be welcome .. espeically on the logistics of flying with a dog ! Karen |
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| josie |
Very interesting.
So - this UK Brittany TAN test, is this for Brittanies only, or is it like the LMC TAN test which is open to all HPR breeds? Karen - The World Dog Show - I've heard of this before. Is it held in a different country each time? Because I thought I'd heard it was in Poland a couple of years ago - does it move around? Flying with a dog is (allegedly) not difficult. You would need to get your dog's Pet Passport sorted out I think - for re-entry to the UK. (I'm assuming you would still need a Pet Passport, although I think Sweden is a rabies-free country.) That can take as long as 7-9mnths before you can go and come back, so it's worth sorting out now if you wanted to go. Once you have the Pet Passport, I believe that now British Airways is insisting that all pet bookings are made through a "pet travel agent". I don't know why, I guess it's easier for them not to have to deal with the general public and fewer things go wrong. They recommend a few different ones on a recorded message when you phone up their cargo department. (I wanted to get a quote for flying to the US.) The pet travel agent will supply a crate as well, correctly sized for your dog, and generally you don't need to worry about anything - they take care of it all. Here is a website for the folk who deal with Continental as their preferred airline: http://www.shipyourpet.com Do France really have a ban on showing docked dogs? I thought the French were one of the last docking strongholds! LOL |
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| josie |
PS Karen, I just looked at that website for the World Dog Show and it says:
"Docked dogs born in Sweden or any other country where a docking ban is currently in force may not be entered at the show. Nor can docked dogs born to a dam with a Danish, Finnish, Norwegian or Swedish owner participate in the show." According to the way this reads, once the docking ban comes into effect in April, the UK would then be a "country where a docking ban is currently in force" and so docked dogs in the UK wouldn't be able to enter (even if docked before the ban)...??? 
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| Marjolein |
I wanted to do the TAN last year, but unfortunately I couldn't make it to the test. So yes, there are TANS for our breed as well Jo. Ask Christophe, I believe he is a member of this board as well. | ||||
| josie |
We are entered for the LMC one next weekend. I know Slate is a bit old/advanced for it (I hope I haven't jnxed myself by saying that!), but I really want to support any form of testing which is not competitive but about reaching standards rather than beating other people. And if enough people support the TANs over here, who knows, maybe they will start running the tests for older dogs as well and before you know it we will have a whole testing programme!? We can live in hope anyway! | ||||
| Liz |
We've been over to see the French Brittany weekend around 5 times now, and will be there again this year. We've always found a very warm welcome, and have got to know quite a few of the people - both French and other nationals. You can learn a lot from watching the dogs in the TAN and it's great to see so many Brits in one place. Also the French lay on a very interesting "Tourism Day" for visitors, which gives you a chance to see some places you might not otherwise visit. | ||||
| BritAnnie |
We can't say that - many of the dogs who do their TAN in the UK have never been 'in the field'! They are often companion or show dogs, with their owners trying to find out if they have the natural ability they should have been born with, and trying to have as much enjoyment with their dogs as possible. They may also be people who would not otherwise try working their dog and this is an ideal way of encouraging them. We mustn't make the mistake that a number of working people have made over the years, of insisting that every gundog should be worked. This would only serve to split the breed like cockers, springers, labradors, and the like. Many owners have neither the time, energy, facility, inclination, nor money to do so. Annie |
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| karenb |
Hi Josie
yes the World Show moves around each year, as does the European Winners Show. The world show was in Ponznan in 2006, this year its in Mexico & 2008 Sweden. The Eurpoean Section Show also moves about - it is in Croatia this year, Hungary in 2008 & the Ireland in 2009. I have just re read the World Show schedule and I will have to check the docking situation but I feel it will only be an issue for dogs born after the 6th April 07. I am also waiting to here from a pet travel agent re-travel details/costs. Once I know the facts I can decide if I will make the trip with or without a dog !! You have me thinking about france .. a friend has been to shows in belgium and Im sure she told me she couldn't show in France because of the docked tail .. perhaps I'm wrong ? karen |
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| guy |
Annie - i think you have mis read me. i suggested that dogs with experience cannot be 'placed' thus if Topaz was to be entered he could not take the Stan Smith Trophy as he is 'experienced' and because of this may be displaying 'learned behaviours' rather than 'natural ones. Mugi on the other hand although ten has no known working experience and thus could take top honours. But that is only the icing on the cake as it were. The dogs entered either meet the assessment criteria or they don't and receive a certificate accordingly Anything that gets a Brittany owner to experience the 'thrill' of seeing their animal react instinctively must be supported and encouraged - well for my money anyway. |
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| munstyman |
Josie wrote:
Looks like I'll have to be on my best behaviour then
Peter |
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| josie |
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