| Archive for workinghprs.myfastforum.org Chat forum for owners of working HPR and Versatile gundog breeds. |
| chiendog |
What's in a name?I've recently posted a short article on my blog about HPR breed names. It is mainly about how I will deal with the hard to pronounce names when I write the breed descriptions in my book, but I have also listed some other issues I will tackle.At the end of the piece I ask for some input regarding specific questions that HPR enthusiasts may have regarding breed names. So I thought I would also post the request here. Does anyone have any questions/comments about the way a particular breed name is pronounced or translated? Any questions/comments about the origins of any names? I'm looking for the important things that I should cover in order to give a complete overview of why's when's and wherefore's of breed names. Thanks, Craig www.chiendog.blogspot.com |
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| Mike |
Craig,
Thought this was an interesting one and was worried it may got lost so have bumped it to the top for a while. |
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| chiendog |
Thanks Mike! | ||||
| josie |
I think Slovakian Rough Haired Pointer is a blimming long and unmanageable name and Slovak is much more manageable. I can hardly fit "Slovakian Rough Haired Pointer" in the box on entry forms and if I abbreviate to SRP, I get calls from secretarys to ask me what breed that is! I'm not saying that's how they should be named in your book, just making an observation! | ||||
| BritAnnie |
This is just why the KC won't let us have Epagneul Breton I think. None of them can pronounce it, spell it, or even know what it means. And it ISN'T French Spaniel 
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| windem bang |
I don't know if this counts but I've always been uncertain whether or not the W in Weimaraner is pronounced as a W or as a V ???
Bill T. |
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| BritAnnie |
And what's the correct spelling of Viszla or Vizsla | ||||
| chiendog |
I was finally able to get my tongue around the whole name after a few lessons from the club secretary in Slovakia. I grew up listening to my father speak Ukrainian to my grandparents, so I think that helped a bit as well, but the name is a tough one to pronounce. I was told that it is perfectly acceptable to drop the hardest word "Hrubosrsty" and just say Slovenski Stavac (Slow-ven-ski Sta Vatch) |
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| chiendog |
Interestingly, the French say "Spaniel" for Cockers, Springers etc. I don't know which is funnier, an English speaker trying to say "Epagneul de Saint Usuge" or a French speaker trying to say "Irish Water Spaniel" So for the record Epagneul Breton is pronounced Aye Pan Yull Bru (like the oo sound of book or look) taw (n) the n is just barely pronounced. Aye Pan Yul Bru Taw(n) |
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| chiendog |
In Germany it is "V". In North America, it is most often "W". In the UK, I have heard both, but my friend Richard Jupp always says "Vye mar ON er" In France, where the breed is known as the Braque de Weimar, the w is pronounced as a "v". Brak deh Vay Mar |
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| chiendog |
Vizsla (Z before the S) The hungarian pronunciation can be heard here: http://www.miravizslas.com/vizsla%20pronounciation.wav |
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| chiendog |
Here is a link to a page that gives audio samples of the way a number of breed names are pronounced.
The voice in the French samples is that of my lovely wife Lisa. http://www.navhda.us/sounds/ |
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| Mike |
Always wondered about Korthals Griffon? I am pretty sure my English version would be waaayyy off 
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| josie |
But in the UK, no one calls Slovaks "Slovensky etcs" - the name is always translated into English and even fewer people would know what you were talking about if you tried to use the Slovakian!!! (And I would be afraid of looking pretentious, to boot!) | ||||
| chiendog |
Griffon can be a tricky one, so can Korthals. In English, Griffon is sometimes pronounced like the name of the star of the Family Guy, Peter Griffin 
Some English speakers give it a French twist by saying Gri-FAWN. However this is not quite right for the French ear. If you want to pronounce it the way the French do, say Gree-faw(n). The first syllable rhymes with "tree" and the "n" in the second syllable is not really pronounced, but does add a nasal sound to the "faw" The name most often associated with the breed is Korthals. In French, it is pronounced Cor (rhymes with door) -tal (ryhmes with pal) Note that the "s" is silent, but it is part of the name Korthals and not a possesive (no apostrophe), it is not Korthal's Griffon. So the breed is known in France and Quebec as "Luh Gree-faw(n) Cor-tal" I will ask my Dutch friends how they pronounce the name. |
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| chiendog |
Hi All,
Just a quick update and a new name to chew on.... re: Korthals Griffon, For the Dutch, it is pronounced Kor (rhymes with door) Tallz (rhymes with falls) Gree fon. So how about Gammel Dansk Hønsehund (can also be spelled Hoensehund)? Try saying THAT name three times quickly (several pints of Guiness may help...) What the heck is a Gammel Dansk Hønsehund you ask? Well, in English, it is the Old Danish Pointer. Gammel = Old, Dansk = Danish, Hønsehund = Pointer (sort of, not really, kind of, it is a long story....) What do they look like? Here's a short, shakey, very home-made video I cobbled together out of scenes I shot in Denmark. http://www.gdh.dk/264.php How do you say the name? GAH-mal DANsk HE(r)N-se(r)-Hun” Those little "r's" in there are to indicate that it is not quite He as in hen or Se as in Soot but...almost like the E in Ernest...but not quite... Oh those crafty Danes, with their tricky nordic language, clean good looks and healthy, open attitude towards sexuality. 
Anyone know if there are direct flights from Winterpeg to Copenhagen? |
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| tashap |
I was always told it was a V instead of W in german language lessons at school this was one of the first things we were taught. | ||||
| weima |
Yes he does. I thought it was only me who noticed that! |
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| chiendog |
You should have seen my father when he noticed something Richard said... Richard: "Right, I think I will go outside for a nice fag" My Dad: "  "
Me: "Dad, in England fag means cigarette, not homosexual" My Dad: "Oh, thank God! For a minute there, I thought we would have to cancel our reservations at Hooters*!" *Hooters is a family restaurant where the waitresses wear...well, not much... and a push-up bra. http://www.hooters.com/ |
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| munstyman |
 I think I've just regained my appetite 
Peter |
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| weima |
Very funny
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| chiendog |
Ok, here's one for you! A bit of a quiz actually.
Prior to about 1887 when the name "Spinone" was officially accepted for the breed what (other) names did it have? And while we are at it, how is Spinone pronounced in English? Bonus points for the plural form.. |
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| Blue |
plural in Italian is Spinoni Italiani.
spee-no-neh singular and spee-no-nee plural Originally named Spinoso after the pino, a thorn bush what do I win?
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| BenB |
How about Sloughi ?
Is it pronounced like the town with an "i" on the end or slooogi? |
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| chiendog |
Not bad! But Spinone Italiano is a bit redundant. You see, there is but one Spinone breed. It is from Italy. So Spinone Italiano is sort of like saying "English Queen of England". I think the "Italiano" part slipped into common useage because of the Bracco Italiano. There are other "Bracco" breeds (the GSP is Bracco Tadesco for example) so the Italiano part of the name is necessary to differenciate it from the others. But for the Spinone it is sufficient to simply say "Spinone". It is pronounced Spee NO nay (the emphasis is on the second syllable) and the plural is pronounce Spee NO ni. To hear it pronounced by an italian, check out this video (in Italian). The very first words the narrator says are "Lo Spinone....etc. etc.." The president of the club Marco Lozza does much of the on screen talking...he has a great voice and speaks very clearly in easy to understand Italian. http://www.spinone-italiano.it/video.asp Note that the video is entitled just "Lo Spinone e il suo mondo" (the Spinone and its world) and not "Lo Spinone Italiano...) |
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| windem bang |
Up thisaway Spinones are often called spaghetti hounds ! 
Bill T. |
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