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workinghprs.myfastforum.org
Chat forum for owners of working HPR and Versatile gundog breeds.
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chiendog
Joined: 09 Jul 2006
Posts: 116
Breed:
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 Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 5:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Are you suggesting the USA is producing shorts and wires that are so diverse in original type they are now considered to be 2 seperate breeds. |
Yes. Some people believe this.
In summary, while from a genetic standpoint, GWP and drahthaars are the same, I strongly believe that when the AKC began registering drahthaars as GWP they became two different distinct breeds.
http://www.wildflugel-drahthaar.c...%20they%20really%20the%20same.htm
Saying that GWP's or German Drahthaars are the same breed as the DD just ain't so - that's like saying that the Cocker Spaniel and the Springer Spaniel are the same breed. In both cases, they used to be, but are no longer.
http://altmoor.com/Deutsch-Drahthaars/ddfaqs.html
For a quick visual, take a look at the dogs here: http://www.rockcreekwalkers.com/
From all reports, they are excellent dogs and have racked up impressive wins in competition. However, they may not be quite what the Germans had in mind.
| Quote: | | If that's the case make it legitimate, not word of mouth. |
It has been suggested but nothing so far has come of it. Unofficially, it has become rather common currency in versatile dog circles to use the different terms, in fact there are even a couple of people calling their dogs "American Wirehaired Pointers"...unofficially of course.
| Quote: | | The Large Munsterlanders US don't call themselves with their German definition of size although they test JGHV. |
Sorry, I am not quite sure I understand this statement, but in any case the current situation of the Large Munsterlander in North America is actually quite interesting. First of all, unlike many of the other continentals, the breed is not represented by a strictly American (US) club. The Large Munsterlander Club of North American is international in scope representing dogs and breeders in Canada and the US. Secondly, the club has taken advantage of a little-known statute in Canada as well as the patent laws in the US to almost "copyright" the name Large Munsterlander (hence the ® symbol after the name on all their official documents and website).
The club website http://www.lmcna.org/#registration explains:
As of January 1, 1983 the Large Munsterlander Club of North America® (LMCNA) maintains the official registry for all LM pups born in North America. Prior to this time registration was done through the German Verband Grosse Münsterländer and records were crosslisted. Close correspondence is maintained with the German club. In the fall of 1999, the Large Munsterlander Club of North America® was incorporated under the Animal Pedigree Act of Canada. This means that performance-based breeding has become an essential element of the breed. Only Large Munsterlanders issued LMCNA papers are recognized as purebred and/or registered. LMCNA received service-mark approval from the U.S. Patent and Trademark office in January 2001.
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A van der Sluis
Joined: 13 Mar 2008
Posts: 42
Location: Holland
Breed: German longhaired Pointer
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| Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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Brenda, the 5 types are the 5 foundation dogs Mylord,Job, Don,Kalcksteiner
and Roland.
I found that in the book written by Karl Brandt. (1909) with all the explanations there. He has written the first book about Deutsch langhaar.
I have also the original pedigrees from the first registered dogs. If you want to see them , i bring them to UK for you. |
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langhaar
Joined: 07 May 2006
Posts: 429
Location: Oxon
Breed: GLP HV
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| Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 8:45 am Post subject: |
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I don't know any breeders who are specifically breeding for a Job, Mylord etc " type ".
Like any new breed making an entry onto the world wide stage information can be accurate and inaccurate. Whatever the testing system, breeder or environment, in my eyes there are only two types of Longhairs, good ones and bad ones. I've seen both in Germany even though a breed master system applies. There are continental breeders who breed GLP's who are as good as those bred by respected breeders in the country of origin. The Germans must think so as their dogs have been featured in the DL Mitteilungen and their kennels have links on Gruppe websites too.
All testing systems are guide lines. Good dogs will be graded high, mediocre ones pass and bad ones will fail. But a breed isn't just about it's performance.
If Americans want 2 types, well that's up to them. It will be interesting to see in time which group produces quality in type , performance and most important of all, temperament. |
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